Auteur Sujet: Battle Mode Goal Total  (Lu 35704 fois)

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Re: Re : Re: Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #15 le: 02 août 2010, à 18:00:22 »
Illustrated with a real-life example, I always play vs Marius online and we both play very aggressive...we can reach a first to 30 in like 1 hour sometimes.  :-X We NEVER spent much time on 1 map.  >:D

The difference between a friendly opposition and an official match is rather huge, and will have a big influence on the way both players will drive, and on their defensive strategies. When you reach an as high level as a CDM quarterfinal, you'll never be able to perform a first to 30 within a single hour. Unless both players are Harold-like drivers who take all risks.

Well if this really poses a problem, then you could set a timer before each showdown to award fast play. For example, give a quarter final a maximum duration of 30 minutes; if the goal-score isn't reached in this time, because both guys are playing like pussies, the guy who is in the lead at this point, gains the win. In the case of a draw play 1 more elimination match to decide.

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Re : Re: Re : Re: Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #16 le: 02 août 2010, à 18:40:49 »
Well if this really poses a problem, then you could set a timer before each showdown to award fast play. For example, give a quarter final a maximum duration of 30 minutes; if the goal-score isn't reached in this time, because both guys are playing like pussies, the guy who is in the lead at this point, gains the win. In the case of a draw play 1 more elimination match to decide.

Very interesting point, and guess what, Claire had the same idea ;D
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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #17 le: 02 août 2010, à 22:52:51 »
I'm totally against this proposition.

Or let's make a first to 21 rounds final in MR and first to 10 cups in GP :P
Mais surtout, je dois faire un très, très gros aparté, où je ne vais pas y aller avec le dos de la cuillère, sur la partie "SMK = eSport", aspect sur lequel certains se fourrent le doigt dans l'œil jusque dans des zones inexplorées de leur anatomie

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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #18 le: 02 août 2010, à 22:55:19 »
joe le venere  ;D
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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #19 le: 02 août 2010, à 23:20:19 »
Nan mais voilà quoi, à un moment donné, il faut quand même réagir clairement quand les gens proposent de la chiasse en barquette ;D
Mais surtout, je dois faire un très, très gros aparté, où je ne vais pas y aller avec le dos de la cuillère, sur la partie "SMK = eSport", aspect sur lequel certains se fourrent le doigt dans l'œil jusque dans des zones inexplorées de leur anatomie

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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #20 le: 03 août 2010, à 13:06:44 »
I don't support this new system. One side I understand the world champion would be more legitimate with a first to 20 final. moreover a short match that ends with 11-3 or 11-4 (drew ;D :-*) could be frustrating for the public and of course for the looser which could have made a return in a longer match (and think about that all life long ::))
but such a system is too random considering the time (for the battle mode). I know in that case a stopwatch could be a good solution, but I don't like the idea of loosing because of the time (it already sucks at street fighter, please don't let it enter in smk :P)

In fact, I think we are already playing a lot at the CDM. it's my opinion, but I don't travel to each places where smk championship takes place only to play smk. I think the classic system of 5-7-9-11 is pas mal enough :) if you increase the number of matchs to get the win, then you have to do the same in MR and GP, and I think the finals phases are already quite long (of course for close matchs) I remember having played a final in battle during 50mn (11-9) it's really enough considering you have played all day long and people who are watching you may be lazy in a match that could be 2 times longer :o

the belgium system seems not bad but one of most important point for me in the championship is to play against a larger part of people. strong and weak. of course a match against someone with same level is more intense, but I like above all to play with everybody within the 4/5 days.
CDM, où tu iras j'irai :-* O0

Bref, je conclue en espérant que vous ouvriez un peu les yeux... :(

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Re: Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #21 le: 03 août 2010, à 13:16:03 »
Yeah you're making some pretty good points Harold. I guess I agree.
I especially don't like the fact you can lose because of a stop-watch as this can even encourage defensive play when you are a few matches in the lead (this happens in SF too when you have more energy than the opponent and time is drawing closer to the end).

There can still be a problem with BM matches that can potentially last forever though, as Mario has signalled earlier, the KO stage apparently takes a lot longer, because of unpredictable insanely long matches happening. This might in the end force us to adopt a time-limit system of sorts. If we are ever going to introduce a time limit to BM matches, I recommend the following:

Once the time limit is exceeded, we still play until the goal score is reached. However, the next matches that take place in over-time are all fought with 1 balloon, to speed up the process. So both players take 2 hits before each match starts and then drive to the middle, at the starting positions of a normal match (or at another location, whatever, as long as you don't have an item ::)). Either that, or we start like normal and the first player who loses a single balloon, loses the match.
« Modifié: 03 août 2010, à 13:24:15 par KVD »

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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #22 le: 03 août 2010, à 13:44:56 »
i didn t give my opinion until now because i should not be concerned (because of the BM quarter finals malediction ::) ), but i completely agree with harold.

i could also add that :
- a 20-17 winner is not necessarly much more legitim than a 11-9 winner...
- a 11-4 loser may not have win anyway in a "first to 20" match
- a too long match could make one player (or both players) lose his concentration after one hour of play, so that the winner would not be the most talented player, but the most endurant one (which is already a bit true, seeing how late the finals are played sometimes :-\ )

i m not sure that modifying the rules (sudden death with the first balloon) is a good idea : it would be like the golden goal in soccer => the 2 players would play a lot more defensive, instead of maybe taking some risks knowing they would still have 2 balloons left if they fail...

so i think that the actual rules are just very good, and better (in terms of a costs/advantages balance) on my opinion that all the new proposition exposed here
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Re : Re: Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #23 le: 03 août 2010, à 13:48:03 »
I think the classic system of 5-7-9-11 is pas mal enough :)

Yeah you're making some pretty good points Harold. I guess I agree.
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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #24 le: 03 août 2010, à 13:54:19 »
On a qu'a utiliser les regles de SPK, au bout d'un temps reglementaire le premier a se prendre une errante gagne  ;D et si ya pas d'errante on joue à "chat"  ;D ;D
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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #25 le: 03 août 2010, à 14:04:39 »
- a too long match could make one player (or both players) lose his concentration after one hour of play, so that the winner would not be the most talented player, but the most endurant one (which is already a bit true, seeing how late the finals are played sometimes :-\ )

Actually this is true as well.  :-X
I think that's also or even mainly because of a too long qualification stage though.

i m not sure that modifying the rules (sudden death with the first balloon) is a good idea : it would be like the golden goal in soccer => the 2 players would play a lot more defensive, instead of maybe taking some risks knowing they would still have 2 balloons left if they fail...

Well in any case this would lead to shorter matches on average (and only after the alloted time has passed), which would be the only reason to introduce this concept anyway.
« Modifié: 03 août 2010, à 14:08:52 par KVD »

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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #26 le: 03 août 2010, à 14:21:48 »
I'm against this new system.

Please don't introduce a timer into BM, things will get worse. I mean, WHAT THE FUCK!!, BM is the only mode where you HAVE to win, by crushing your oponent's balloons. Introducing a timer will MAKE people play pussy (as when there's a draw in football or Street Fighter). You can't predict any length of a match, and that's what is thrilling in this mode. And by the way, is playing defensively being pussy? :P I prefer to watch one round that last hours because players keep avoiding red shells (or maybe you find avoiding red shells = pussy?) rather than three rounds that lasted 1 minute because players drove over-risky, and ended with 3 "don't move" :P. More agressive play doesn't always mean more thrilling matches :P. I do LIKE when Map 1 lasts forever.

I find the current system perfect. Tell me one BM final where the new longer system could have been better. If one player is too strong, he'll win anyway (just like on 11-3 or 11-4 finals), so 21-11 is just the same in proportions. And losing 10-11 because of a random factor IS beautiful, because if both players reach 10-10, it means that the have the same level, so only random can settle the victory. I mean, just trust the game. It's not like football where external factors can ruin the game (referee, injury). Those ARE random factors. SMK is just skills.

And about meeting people of every level in the CDM, I totally share Harold's views.

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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #27 le: 03 août 2010, à 14:23:45 »
Amen  8)
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Re : Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #28 le: 03 août 2010, à 14:25:14 »
I like the idea of an allowed time with a sudden death, of course both players would play very defensive but once again, in terms of suspense, we could see great match finals.

The only problem there is to estimate what would be a decent time limit for each phase, because I'm not sure we have the requested data to find what could suit to each step. For example, does anyone know how long the epic Harold vs Sami 2008 quarterfinal lasted? Same question with the tighest semifinals and finals ever played in the past.

If we don't find this kind of info, we should think about basing ourselves on the 2010 matches to introduce the time limit system in 2011, since we would have serious statistics to base on.

EDIT: dammit, having a look at Gatchan's post, he's rather right too. Especially on the pussy playing part ::) ;D
« Modifié: 03 août 2010, à 14:27:15 par Mario »
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Re: Battle Mode Goal Total
« Réponse #29 le: 03 août 2010, à 14:31:48 »
Actually I think last year's final would have been a lot better in a first to 20. Drew would have had time to recover (and get used to Koopa again) and would have made it a closer match; hard to prove, but likely. But that's not the point.

Also, the timer would only be used as a last resort when a match would simply take toooo long. And then I'm not talking about individual matches, but an entire match-up (so say an entire Quarter Final). LONG matches are still welcome & cool and will still happen, the only difference would be, that when there are too many in a row at one stage, the time-damage for the organisation would be kept within proportions, by making a couple of shorter matches after the time limit has passed.

Also, if too many red shells are dodged the game becomes potentially broken. I don't know if you ever stopped to think about this, but if a couple of players would reach the lvl of Geo (in terms of red dodging...watch the final of last year, Geo almost doesn't get hit by red shells, no matter what Drew, as the reigning World Champion even!, tried), EVERY match would be decided by a random green + double balloon KO (the infamous French hattrick) punishment to profit from the random green immediately after. So yes to a certain extend, if you're driving patterns are as such that you are always in a position to dodge a red shell, you ARE playing pussy and ruining the mode.
« Modifié: 03 août 2010, à 14:36:41 par KVD »